Well, there were a ton of turkeys there, so I can’t be sure that he actually got a piece of mine. Phoebe’s dad told me that after the feast he went in to find that his turkey had been misplaced, and never even opened!
Thank goodness you bit on the gender thing! I was beginning to think that you weren’t reading anymore! Deny it! Females go to the bathroom together, males don’t. Maybe not all, but historically that has been the case for me…
No, I don’t deny it (though I prefer to go to the bathroom alone, thankyouverymuch). I would call it a societal thing, though, not a gender thing.
My identity as a female does not make me think that I have to go to the bathroom with a friend. But I think that society has taught us women that we need to be social at all times. Also, the conditions at many public restrooms are such that there is often a wait. There may be the same number of stalls in a women’s bathroom as there are in a men’s bathroom, but we don’t have urinals, and it takes us four times as long as our brothers to do our business, hence a wait. A wait is much more palatable when you have a friend to talk to.
That’s all I’m sayin’.
"That’s all I’m sayin’,” I don’t think so!
I’m not suggesting that is an identity thing. I just think it is a thing that most women are comfortable with, and expect. Men’s restrooms are stark and business like (in general). One time as a grad student, my mind filled with the task at hand, I walked quickly down the hall to… er… take care of business. I opened the door and walked in, and even in my deep thoughts immediately knew I was in the wrong restroom. It was huge. It had a separate room for women to sit and do whatever it is that women do in those areas. There was more space in this bathroom than the office I shared with another person. That may not be normal, but I will admit to being distracted enough to walk into several women’s restrooms. Shutup. It wasn’t on purpose, and I was very embarrassed when I was unable to get out before being spotted. Fortunately, I was always greeted with laughter, and not shrieks of fear.
I agree that much of what we discuss as gender-related behaviors is largely influenced by society. It goes both ways. Try being a single father and walking into a restaurant where the owner has met your daughter and the people with whom you are eating, and asking them if it is ok for “this man” to have is arm affectionately around this little girl. A woman would not experience that even if she walked up to a completely strange child.
And don’t pull the urinal thing out! We usually have fewer stalls because of urinals. It really takes four times as long for women to complete their business? What the heck are you doing in there? Or are you saying that it is a GENDER THING that women take longer to “do their business?”
(You’d better hope that Altera never makes me an offer I can’t refuse. Your office will become soapbox central!!!)
"What the heck are you doing in there?”
Um… how graphic do you want me to be? (I’m sorry, Leslie, I know you’re probably reading this and I blush).
All you guys gotta do is whip it out and let fly in the urinal, no matter who is there. Unzip, whizz, zip up, wash hands, done. Urinals are a more efficient use of space; the turnaround is much higher than stalls.
We have to have our own little private stall where, depending on what we’re wearing, have to go through various stages of undress, make sure the seat is in a condition to meet our most private of places (and perhaps perform tasks of cleaning up after the person who went before us---don’t let anyone tell you that women are cleaner than men, it just ain’t so), then actually DO our business, then clean up afterwards, get dressed again, then go wash our hands and hope there’s some towels to use---all while balancing a purse on one shoulder.
That’s what we’re doing in there. “Powder our noses” my derriere. Don’t EVEN get me started about makeup. (But I wear it.)
I totally agree that gender roles go both ways. People are stuck in their own little paradigms, and if we want to fit in, we have to subscribe with them, even if we don’t agree to them. Women have to wear makeup and be thin and if they are in positions of authority, risk being labeled as bitches. Men have to be strong and brusk and <s>drive big pickup trucks</s> have an intimate relationship with power and be labeled as the idiot in relationships.
The first thing to do to change these paradigms is to recognize their existance. Recognize that what we’re doing may (or may not!) fall into the paradigm that is applied to gender stereotypes. Then we look at the behavior, decide whether it’s because of the paradigm that we’re doing it, and then decide if we want to continue it.
I’m not practicing what I preach all the time. But at least I hope to be aware of it.
I was tempted to make a gender-biased joke, but was afraid you’d take me serious, so I’ll just say I thought about it!
My dear Meera. Strangely enough, I agree with most everything you said. I dare say that your description of bathroom behavior fairly supports my thoughts about women in the bathroom, though. And by the way, I appreciate you describing what women go through in the restroom, but your description of men in the bathroom is a bit inaccurate. We (guys in general) might even describe it the same way because we don’t want to go into detail, but there is a bit more to it than “whipping it out.” Of course, it depends on the clothes…
In my worthless opinion there are simply things that are GENERALLY gender related behaviors. I agree that we need to change our perception on many. But not all. As a single person who at times entertains dating, I’m completely confused by the myriad of differences among women’s desires. Should I open the door as I was raised to do? Should I pay for meals? What the heck?
I’m perfectly willing and interested in changing stereotypes that cast the other gender in a bad light. Society needs to stop treating me as a deviant for taking care of my daughter. Similarly, I don’t believe that blondes are stupid (although, I love the jokes). I also don’t believe that women are inferior in performing the same jobs as men. Being dedicated to Annie, I love the fact that women have so much control over their lives these days. In fact, they have more than men. Tim Allen said it best in a stand-up comedy performance. Women have many choices these days: go to work full time, go to work part time, stay at home with kids and home, and whatever combination thereof. Men have two: work or penetentiary.
Nice dig on the big truck thing. I have one vehicle. It does everything I need it to do no matter what the need. It was a choice I made, No, I’m not trying to compensate for anything!
You rock, and I love these conversations. I hope I don’t tick you off too much. By the way, I love the tie-dye bag Annie got at Julian’s birthday, so there!
Ha ha! No, I’m up for the challenge! If you ticked me off, I would just roll my eyes and walk away. I guess I can’t leave well enough alone. (You caught me working late tonight, which is why I’m responding now...)
Your opinion isn’t worthless! pshaw! But I hope you find someone who doesn’t make assumptions about who and what you “should” be because you’re a man, and think that you should treat her a particular way because she’s a woman. That will cause those confusions to melt away. You should date a PERSON, not a GENDER. You know? That’s really where I’m coming from. Open a door? Pay for dinner? Those decisions should not be an issue. I hold the door open for men, and I appreciate it when they do the same for me. When I was dating, I appreciated it when someone bought me dinner, but I didn’t assume that he would, just because I am a woman and he was a man. It’s just common courtesy.
And you said it, I didn’t, about compensation. I made no connection there. *innocent look*
Well, should I decide to date a PERSON they will have to be of the opposite GENDER from me!
I’m just picky that way…
Julian never eats turkey. But he said he ate an entire piece---a big piece---of the turkey you made! He said he really liked the white meat. Need to get your recipe.
And… just ‘cause I am rising to the bait… “a gender thing”???
<font size=-2>...does this hook in my lip make my face look fat?</font>